Dennis Chambers... Best Memory

[Shawn40]

DC could play with anybody he wants charts or not !!!

Com'on Guys, we are talking about Dennis Chambers here, Dennis Chambers !!! [img]cool.gif[/img]

PS : Corea loves Tom Brechtlein too, and me too, Tom has the fire inside him and his drumming.

[Selim36]

Originally posted by Vdrummer:
The thread thus far....

1) Dennis is a great drummer, with a great groove.

4) Why not develop both skills?

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Does anyone think that learning to read this late in the game would influce his playing in a negative way? Maybe his groove would change and sound less funky. Does the old addage, 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it' apply here?

Although there's a real possiblity that he would become SUPER CHARGED Dennis Chambers!

[drumaddix]

Hey Sus,i think it's an interesting thread dude.
Reminds me that i should keep improving my reading skills which are far from being excellent.Even tho' i rely on memory most of the time,i assume being a better reader would not do me any harm. [img]wink.gif[/img]

[Suspiria]

Originally posted by Selim36:
Does anyone think that learning to read this late in the game would influce his playing in a negative way?

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Not at all! Lets face it: The man has been standing still for well over a decade. Check out solos/playing from several years ago. I see no maturing/evolution as a musician or drummer. I really wouldn't any longer consider him someone that is really pushing the limits.

That being said, I doubt that learning to read more comfortable can improve him in that department, atleast significantly.

[spaceotter]

Regarding the issue about Gadd reading Chick charts, I went to the San Jose, CA stop on Gadd's clinic tour (have yet to post the review despite copious notes--still completing my move from Cali to Seattle and things are slightly choatic). Someone asked Gadd about his hardest sessions. He said that this Chick session was one of the hardest he recalls, in that the charts were so massive that he couldn't even read them--and only Chick's voluminous piano parts, from which he had to extrapolate the drums.

Apparently Gadd had to post the chart on the wall to even read it, and that was just the beginning of the fun. This was nothing that Chick would have asked from anyone but the most accomplished session master with years of chart reading under their belts. So to amplify what was said above, a couple hours of learning would not have helped DC get this gig. When Chick wants someone to read, he isn't asking for a middle school reader with monster chops. Dennis would have probably a long haul to catch up with Gadd's years of practice in this area.

Dennis must know at this point that reading is not why people hire him. His gig is ears, chops, groove sans charts and everybody knows it. He still gets hired more than all but a couple of the folks on this board. Perhaps it's lazy of him. Perhaps he isn't growing. Perhaps he is the god of ears&memory and we should stand in awe. Whatever. Those are his choices and aptitudes. Evaulating his strengths and weaknesses is fun in a baseball card trading kind of way but ends there for me, unless he were here to respond about these choices and aptitudes himself.

Every strength suggests shadow weaknesses...maybe that's something to learn from this (doens't have to turn into a HOD mud sling). I would be way more interested in finding out *how* he developed those ears, how to improve my own, or how Gadd/Vinnie learned to connect the dots (of charts) so well. My 2 cents.

Peace all.

[matricks]

My two cents is that Dennis isn't pushing the limits anymore and he admits that he doesn't practice anymore. He has, however, pushed it farther when he WAS pushing it than most big-name drummers ever will (right place at the right time, maybe). The other two cents is that i bet he DOES actually read, but he plays it down because he isn't good at it and prefers to seem enigmatic about it... prefering others to say that he is a phenom who can't read a single note rather than someone who is a great drummer but a sub-par reader. Either way, no biggie for me since i have never been a big Dennis fan; just thinking i would chime in [img]wink.gif[/img]

$0.02

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ November 06, 2005 08:31 PM: Message edited by: matricks ]</font>

[Vdrummer]

You guys all make good points. I don't particularly care whether Dennis reads or not, his career speaks for itself.

Also true, he'd have to work at reading very hard to gain the kind of skills someone who's a good reader has developed. And since Dennis readily admits he hasn't practiced in 20 years, that obviously ain't gonna happen. That may be why some feel his solos from the mid-80's to today haven't changed all that much.

My previous post wasn't really even geared toward him (he isn't going to read it) but more towards drummers here, that may not read passably. I encourage everyone here to learn to read at least to the middle school level. The fact that Dennis doesn't read, and I've heard him say that too, is not something about him we should admire. If his memory has developed more in compensation for that deficit, well, it had to. Otherwise, he'd have been unable get as far as he has. Reading is just one more skill some drummers have developed, like a good grip, that helps them excel. Many great players don't read, but many of them would admit that if they could push a button and instantly become a good reader on top of their other abilities, they'd push that button.

Here's another thought. Charting out tunes for yourself can make it easier to memorize them. When I join a band I often chart out the tunes and I've found the simpler the chart (focusing on form and any breaks or odd length sections) can help me memorize the important parts of the tune. On the other extreme, reading a transcription or overly detailed chart can be a performance crippling endeavor.

Brad

[Suspiria]

Fantastic comments by otter, matricks, and Vdrummer. Enjoyed reading your thoughts!

[matricks]

Funny thing, when people talk about drummers and how they should be able to read at a middle school level... well, think about that for a minute. Makes one wonder why we wonder about having a bad rap [img]redface.gif[/img]

[PocketPlayer]

I went through a lot of years of unbelievable guilt as far as how successfull I would get in the studio. And I feel I was only successful because of experience, not because I was some drumming phenomenon. How you play with phones, with a click, with a rhythm section is all experience, experience, experience. Reading, too. I can't read shit. When I see a dotted quarter with an eighth note, I've gotten to know what that little figure sounds like. If I scuffle, I say to myself, "Okay, just play time through this, listen to what the guitar player or bassist played and nail it the second time."--Jeff Porcaro 1988

Again, this isn't the rule, but another exception.

I wish I developed this skill more, but didn't need it for what I did early on. If I worked in the studios, and the game rules were you needed to read to work...well, I would learn to read just like develop better time and groove...no brianer.

I have developed a very good memory, but have always felt a little insecure about what I can't do well. This can be a plus because I try hard with new people to get it right and that energy is felt as having a good attitude...much of it is insecurity, especially if I don't have a tape of the tunes beforehand to...memorize [img]wink.gif[/img]